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Thread: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

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    Love and respected by everyone Knipper's Avatar

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    Default Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    Oupa suggested I start a new thread on this subject since there seems to be a lot of interest in it. So, I thought I'd document and share the tips and techniques I use to come up with what I want to be a well made liner-lock pocket knife.

    Since I have to keep up with orders and shows and "honey-do lists", I'll have to take it in stages, but I'll try to keep things rolling. What I plan to cover will start with materials I use, how to come up with a design, what tools I use and maybe most importantly, WHY I do things a certain way. As I've stated before, there are many ways to get this done, witnessed by several books, blogs, discussions and pictures about liner lock construction.

    Please don't let the tools I own and use intimidate you and persuade you to think that you can't make a knife unless you have the same tools I do! Remember, I've been at this for over 25 years, and I'm not wealthy. I had to accumulate all my stuff a little at a time when there was extra money (not too often!) in the shop fund. I chose to buy them because I thought they would make life easier in the shop....they do! But if one can't make a knife with hand tools, then all the fancy equipment out there won't be of help. It just takes more time and effort. They are just a means to an end and don't determine the outcome of a project...the maker does.

    My way is NOT the 'correct' way nor is it the only way. In fact, I'm hoping that by describing how I make a liner lock, those who follow along and try to make one themselves, will eventually improve upon the process and come up with better techniques and their own designs. Hopefully, they will then pass along what they've learned and discovered to someone else, and encourage another beginner in their efforts. I certainly wasn't born with the knowledge of how to make a knife. Yes, there was a lot of trial and error on my part, but it took other makers sharing what they know with me, to give me a giant head start in the whole process. After I learned the basics, I was eventually able to come up with a few improvements (to me, anyway) that made things easier and increased the odds of success for my efforts.

    It helps me to think of making a knife as a simple series of steps, each one affecting the others. If the initial steps are done well, then usually, a good outcome (a nice knife you made yourself!) will follow. I've been making knives from scratch since 1983. I didn't start folders until 10 to 15 years ago, and liner locks within the last 10 years. One thing about this whole business never ceases to give me tremendous satisfaction...that my efforts please someone else to the extent that they want to give me their hard earned money for one of my knives. I can think of no greater compliment. Of course, its not about the money, though its necessary to continue making knives. If you figure an hourly wage, and then the cost of materials, this craft won't make anyone rich (there are of course, rare exceptions..). You have to love it to continue. (What's that old joke?? "If I had a million dollars, I'd just keep making knives until it was all gone...!)

    Well, enough of the philosophy....the next 'installment' will get into materials used for the design work and construction of the knife. I'll try to provide meaningful photos whenever I can, and make sure we're all on the same page when it comes to terminology.

    I hope this will be of some help to those interested! Please keep the posts coming with questions, comments, and of course the needling, razzing and joking for which the CLB O TRU BSTDS are famous.

    Knipper
    Terry Knipschield
    www.knipknives.com
    Ye Original Tenacious Bstd (CLB O TRU BSTDS)

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    thieve blind_mouse's Avatar

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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    I am an excited and HAPPY Bastid!!

    Cannot wait to try one "your way". Aparently my way dosent work very well.

    Thank you for the time you will put into this!!

    --BM

    Ye Dessert dwellin', Ale drinkin', Metal meltin', Outside-the-box-thinkin' Bstd (CLB O TRU BSTDS)

    McGurk: I was right and you were wrong....and now you're miserable.... and that is good.
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    Minister of Leather mitch13's Avatar

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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    Terry good on you mate
    I just made it a sticky thread, so it's easy to find
    Mitch
    Redhand Leather
    http://www.allaboutpocketknives.com/...php?category=3

    "ye Original Sneaky Bstd (CLB OF TRU BSTDS)"

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    Love and respected by everyone Knipper's Avatar

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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    Thanks, Mitch...I hope I can do it justice!

    Knipper
    Terry Knipschield
    www.knipknives.com
    Ye Original Tenacious Bstd (CLB O TRU BSTDS)

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    Ramanon ownz me and I need a custom title

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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    I for one am so thankful for this thread Terry. Very exciting!!!!

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    Champion Nessmuk Builder Karel's Avatar

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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    I cant wait for trying my new milling/drilling machine on some folders.

    Thank you for this thread. Impatiently waiting for the continue.
    Karel aka cosco
    Ye Original Perfectionist Bstd (CLB O TRU BSTDS)

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    Love and respected by everyone Knipper's Avatar

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    Default Design and how parts work together...

    In trying to organize this "virtual seminar", its becoming clear that its going to be a bit more complicated than if all of you could just look over my shoulder in my shop! I'd be there to instantly answer questions and show you first hand.

    So, I'd like to propose that we start with an established pattern of mine, which I'll post here as soon as I get a good image. That way, I can write in some terminology that defines the parts of the blade and liners etc. With a reference as to what I call things and where they are, we can all be on the same page when questions arise. For example, when I'm referring to a particular part of the knife, I can just say "locking surface of the tang, 'figure A' and you can look at the diagram and know exactly where it is and what I'm talking about.

    When I post the image, I'm hoping it will be actual size...maybe a PDF format would be best. What I recommend, is that you print this off and make several copies. The next step would be to cut out the various components from the drawings (cut INSIDE the pencil lines), paste them on some thin scrap such as sheet metal, and cut/grind them to shape. Drill holes where I show them and make an actual metal pattern. They should then fit together in a way that you can see and feel what is going on when the parts work together. You don't have to cut the tab, or anything like that, but just seeing how the blade pivots, and fits within the handle shows a lot! You can then see how removing metal, changing the dimensions in a given area, or shifting the position of stop pin holes or the pivot hole affects other components. Everything you do on these knife parts affects something else.

    The pattern will be a Wharncliffe (in fact, the one I'm going to use for Oupa's knife) as it appears to be popular Down Under

    When you understand the relationship between the parts, the sky is the limit when it comes to designing a different blade or handle shape. When I want to do a new design, I sketch out the profile of the entire knife when it is open. Then I put a dot where I think the pivot should be (NOTE: it is very rare that a design will work when the pivot hole is CENTERED on the blade tang...you need to leave room for the spacer bar when closed, so the pivot hole is usually closer to the edge side of the knife, than it is to the back side. Start with 55% of the width of the tang from the back of the blade, and adjust from there) I trace the pattern on mylar drafting film (much more durable than tracing paper or vellum) and then trace the blade only on another sheet. After lining up the pivot dots, I put a straight pin through the pivot dot, and rotate the blade tracing so it folds into the handle area. Then I can see where I need more room and what problems I'll encounter.

    You can start your own design that way, or just with the blade or handle, depending on what you want the knife to look like. If you want a particular blade shape, then draw it, put in a dot where you want the pivot, and then make another tracing of the blade. put a pin through the pivot area and rotate the blade so the point is down (in what will be a closed positon). Now trace those together on one sheet. With the blade open and closed, you can see what shape the handle will need to be to accommodate that blade shape. Or...start with a handle shape you'd like. Establish where the pivot might be and draw the blade within the handle. Trace the blade shape on another sheet and then using a pin on the pivot again, rotate the blade shape into the open position. If things don't line up, you can see where you need to leave more or less room so everything will work.

    When I finally get a pattern to work on paper, and its one that I like and think I might do again, I make a sheet metal template so I don't have to invent the wheel all over again! I just clamp the template on the steel I'm going to use and scribe it out onto the steel. I know exactly where all the holes should be, and this saves a lot of time . It also keeps my scrap pile from growing too large. If you don't want to make a metal template, stick with the mylar. But when you get a pattern you like, DON'T cut it up. Save it for future reference and make copies from which to cut out the various components.

    Does this plan sound OK with everyone? I really don't know how else to give you a feel for how the folder works unless you get one in your hand. I'll post the pattern as soon as possible so you can start playing!

    Knipper
    Terry Knipschield
    www.knipknives.com
    Ye Original Tenacious Bstd (CLB O TRU BSTDS)

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    Friction Folder Build Champ 09 mpphoto's Avatar

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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    Amazingly generous of you.
    Looking forward to it!
    Michael

    Ye Scandi Build'n Knife Modd'n Bstd (CLB O TRU BSTDS)

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    PhD Univ. of Life oupa's Avatar

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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    Gather around you Bastids this is going to be good......
    Ye Original Ol Bstd (CLB O TRU BSTDS)


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    Love and respected by everyone Knipper's Avatar

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    Default Pattern images with terminology

    I'm sending these through at the max allowed size, but I don't know how large it will be when the image is saved and printed. If it will be any help, the length from blade point to bottom of the handle should be around 7 1/2 inches. I'm providing a clean image to use for cut outs and another with my feeble attempt of uncluttered descriptions of various parts of the knife. My computer with the right software to print neatly on images is down right now, so my printing will have to do!

    Look these over, cut 'em out and play a bit. See what happens when holes are repositioned and various dimensions are changed. If you go to the trouble to make some sheet metal templates, you will get a much more tactile feel for how the parts work. Just shift the blade a tad either direction from the pivot and notice how it either opens up or makes an area too tight!

    This is just a start, guys....I'll try for some good close up pics when I do my next knife. Please be sure to ask lots of questions, as when you've done this as often as I have, you take certain things for granted. Then when you actually do try to record every separate step, you amaze yourself with just how many there are! No matter....as I said its just a step by step process, each step building on the previous one.
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    Love and respected by everyone Knipper's Avatar

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    Default Liner lock images

    Here's the image with terminology:
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    Terry Knipschield
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    Default Materials I use, and why...

    Maybe this would be a good time to discuss what materials I use, and why I prefer them over other materials.

    Liners: I use titanium alloy sheet for these, 6AL4V...that stands for 90% titanium, with 6% aluminum and 4% vanadium mixed in. The most common thickness I use is .050", but I've used as thin as .040. Too much thinner than that kind of defeats its purpose as a stiff, safe lock that prevents accidental closure. It won't rust. Its a natural spring that doesn't have to be heat treated. You can bend it to shape, and it will stay there, still functioning as a spring. It is wear resistant; though it will 'burnish' over time, it will not wear down very much through repeated contact and pressure against the hardened tang of the knife. It will work harden, if dull drill bits are used, and I'll tell you this...you do NOT want to try drilling work hardened 6AL4V. It eats drill bits for breakfast. However, a sharp regular drill bit will go right through it with constant pressure and medium rpms on the drill. Some other makers I know use regular steel, of one variety or another, and then heat treat it. To me, this is an unnecessary step, when this great alloy is all ready to use. Other stainless or tool steels may get a bit too smooth against the blade tang after repeated use, and may cause the locking tab to slip, causing failure. I don't ever want that to happen when I'm using a knife as I need my fingers to work! Scrap 6AL4V can be found where ever they make airplanes. Sometimes you can just google it and find good local sources. I ran into a real deal once, where a company had some perfect cut sheets of it, which was left over from a job. They didn't want to inventory the scrap and I bought it 30% less than market value because of the size...works great for me, though, as a knife liner isn't very wide...their 'scrap' was about 18" wide and they cut the sheet into 3ft long sections for me at no charge!

    Blade steel: I don't want to get into an argument here over which steel is 'better'. I've seen too many heated discussions about stainless vs. 'high carbon' steel. First of all, stainless is also high carbon! The only difference is the chromium mixed in to give hardness and resist rust. Good stainless works fantasic...poor stainless is worse than rotten for blade steel. A lot of people just don't take care of their knives anymore, and due to neglect, or other circumstances, their blades are allowed to rust or corrode. They don't work very smoothly in folders when that happens. Ease of sharpening shouldn't be a factor either. I went to diamond and ceramic hones long before I owned and used stainless steel. Why? because I can hone dry, the hones wont 'dish out' like man made or natural stones, and it takes less work to get the job done. They've never failed to put a scary sharp edge on my knives. Some say stainless has "no soul". To me, the character or personality of a knife is more related to performance, design and how it feels in your hand. Having said that, I also use O1, 5160, L6 and 1095 for some of my fixed blade knives, when I want to make a blade that will be used to do more than just cutting. There are ways to heat treat tool steel that make them pretty much indestructible. But for folders, I want cutting performance and low maintenance and so choose stainless. I had been using ATS-34 for years, but have now come to really like CPM154CM, a powder metal steel that has a tight grain that finishes up beautifully, holds a great edge, and has good lateral stress resistance. 440C is good too. But use what YOU are comfortable with...its all good.

    Bolsters: Use anything you think looks good. I've everything from brass to damascus. My standard models use 416 stainless, which works good and holds up well.

    Handle material: Again, whatever you think looks good. I've used wood, pearl, micarta, carbon fiber, bone, and stag. I like the looks of a nice jigged bone for a using pocket knife though...

    Screws: I'm going to plug my friend and teacher R.B. Johnson here. He has the most varied inventory of small screws suitable for knife construction I've ever found. His prices are very reasonable too. You can get black oxide, gold plated, and stainless finishes. He has button head, flat head, and socket head screws with a variety of drives in a variety of sizes. I prefer the Torx, or 6 lobe drives, as they don't strip out very easily. He also carries 1/8" and 3/16" pivots, as well as all the taps and drills and drivers one might need to use on a folder. Why use screws to put the knife together? Well, in making a liner lock, you end up taking it apart and putting it together many times before its finished. The screw together construction accommodates that well, and I've never had a knife come apart or loosen for a customer.

    Have I missed something? The above materials pretty much cover it, I think, but I'll gladly field some questions should you have any.

    Knipper
    Last edited by Knipper; 08-21-2008 at 10:55 AM.
    Terry Knipschield
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    Friction Folder Build Champ 09 mpphoto's Avatar

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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    Great stuff Terry!
    For us basement knifemakers does the titanium cut well with a benchtop bandsaw or by hand with a jewelers saw?

    I have a million questions but I don't want to get ahead of the tutorial as they may be answered as we go along.

    Thanks!
    Michael

    Ye Scandi Build'n Knife Modd'n Bstd (CLB O TRU BSTDS)

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    Love and respected by everyone Knipper's Avatar

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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    M.P....

    Yes, that's what I use...
    I have a friend that cuts all his slots with a dremel tool cut off wheel. He goes through a few, but they're cheap. I'll get into that, though. In fact, after cutting out the liners to shape, cutting the locking tab is the next step and the one I think is most important. I hope to have some good photos of it.

    Terry
    Terry Knipschield
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    Probably quoted in a sig line by now Stew's Avatar

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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    Quote Originally Posted by Knipper View Post

    Screws: I'm going to plug my friend and teacher R.B. Johnson here. He has the most varied inventory of small screws suitable for knife construction I've ever found. His prices are very reasonable too. You can get black oxide, gold plated, and stainless finishes. He has button head, flat head, and socket head screws with a variety of drives in a variety of sizes. I prefer the Torx, or 6 lobe drives, as they don't strip out very easily. He also carries 1/8" and 3/16" pivots, as well as all the taps and drills and drivers one might need to use on a folder. Why use screws to put the knife together? Well, in making a liner lock, you end up taking it apart and putting it together many times before its finished. The screw together construction accommodates that well, and I've never had a knife come apart or loosen for a customer.
    What size do you recommend?

    I have a bunch of 1-72s but I'm wondering if they're a bit small. 2-56 better?

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    Love and respected by everyone Knipper's Avatar

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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    Stew...

    I use 2-56 (3/8" long) button head torx drive for the pivot. Mostly because the 1/8" pivot rod is already threaded for that size. 3/8" long 0-80 button head torx screws are what I use for the bottom bolster screw(trimming them down from the backside), and to fasten the handles to the liners. To screw the two liners together (with the spacer bar in between) I use 1/2" long 0-80 flat head torx drive screws. I usually go as long as I can figuring that I can always trim them, but if they're too short...you're 'screwed', pardon the pun!

    You didn't mention what the head was on those 1-72's. If they're button head, they should work just fine for fastening the handles and bolsters. If they're flat head, they'll work for screwing the liners and spacer bar together (if they're 1/2" long) , so they won't go to waste.

    Terry
    Terry Knipschield
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    Love and respected by everyone Knipper's Avatar

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    Default Question on photo preferences...

    Just wanted to pose a quick question...

    On posting images during construction, do you want to see stuff like cutting out/profiling the liners and blade, drilling etc? That's pretty basic stuff and I didn't want to waste space or viewing time if you'd rather just see key points, and what I do differently in liner lock construction. I'm willing to do whatever the forum wants to see, though.
    (My wife just agreed to hold the camera and shoot some pics over my shoulder should I need it!)

    Terry
    Terry Knipschield
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    Ramanon ownz me and I need a custom title

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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    I'm just speaking for myself here - but I'll be happy with "end of the current step" pics.

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    Probably quoted in a sig line by now Stew's Avatar

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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    Quote Originally Posted by Knipper View Post
    You didn't mention what the head was on those 1-72's. If they're button head, they should work just fine for fastening the handles and bolsters. If they're flat head, they'll work for screwing the liners and spacer bar together (if they're 1/2" long) , so they won't go to waste.
    Thanks Terry. I have both flat heads and button heads so I should be able to manage something.

    Quote Originally Posted by Knipper View Post
    Just wanted to pose a quick question...

    On posting images during construction, do you want to see stuff like cutting out/profiling the liners and blade, drilling etc? That's pretty basic stuff and I didn't want to waste space or viewing time if you'd rather just see key points, and what I do differently in liner lock construction. I'm willing to do whatever the forum wants to see, though.
    (My wife just agreed to hold the camera and shoot some pics over my shoulder should I need it!)

    Terry
    space and viewing time is infinite! Bear in mind that not all folk have the same level of skills...

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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    Hey all...trying to get these done as soon as I can. I know its tough to wait, but I have to work these in when I can...

    At least this post will have some nice starter pics and a few tips I hope you'll find helpful.

    If you've made a metal pattern from the drawing, proceed to the pic. Otherwise, if you've a paper cut out of the pattern, transfer the pattern onto steel as follows.

    Cut out the blade shape right at the pencil line, but leave an extra 1/16" or a few mm at the tang end. You want some extra material for later fitting, and therefore extra steel at the tang end is necessary...so again...DON'T cut to the pencil line at the tang end, leave extra for now...a later pic will show about how much I leave. Now spray the back of the paper with some spray adhesive or use rubber cement.

    A note regarding the steel stock you'll be using. If you want to save some hassles, buy precision ground stock. Its already flat and parallel. 1/8" should do the job. Since I have a small surface grinder, the stock I buy is much rougher and slightly oversize, so I grind it flat down to the thickness I want.

    Place the paper pattern on the stock so there are no ripples in the pattern. Let dry. Now take a sharp punch and make a deep dot right in the middle of the pivot hole circle. Give it a good rap! Next do the same thing to the dot where the thumb stud will be. Now take a magic marker, and staring about a quarter inch inside the paper pattern, make a broad stroke that carries over onto the steel. Continue this all the way around until they meet the first stroke. I do it this way as opposed to just tracing a line around the paper because the markers bleed under the paper and will smudge that nice line you're trying to get. When the marker has dryed, peel off the paper pattern. You should have a nice clear area of what will be the blade with a lot of cross hatch marks all around. Cut or grind out the profile right to the line of the blade.

    For those using the scribed method, grind so that the scribe line just disappears. I usually refine the profile of the blade by then using a disc grinder, or a belt sander with platen and work rest at 90 degrees to the platen. Its just a good idea not to leave really deep scratches anywhere on the blade blank at this point. 150 to 240 grit will work fine for the 'final profile sanding'.
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    Love and respected by everyone Knipper's Avatar

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    Default Surface Grinding

    Cutting and profiling is kinda grunt work. Nothing really satisfying, but its how you start. You can cut out the liner profiles now, too, if you'd like, but we won't get to them for a while.

    Here, the pic shows me surface grinding the blank to the thickness I want. If you've used precision ground stock, this is already done for you!
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    Default Scribing the edge grind guide lines

    A long time ago, I bought this cheap ass height gauge because it had a nice carbide scribe on it. I measure the thickness of the blade (in this case, .120) and decide how thick I want the preliminary thickness of the edge to be prior to heat treating. best not to get too thin at this point. So, I choose .040".

    Subtract that from the total blade thickness and you get .080". Divide that by two and you get .040". I set the height gauge for .040 and scribe all the way around the blade, flip it over and do it again.
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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    I now have two nice parallel lines, the center section of which will be my edge thickness when I'm done grinding.
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    Default Drilling the blade pivot

    Well, this is kinda simple, but note: make sure your drilling table or vise is good and square. If this hole gets drilled at an angle, you're pretty much screwed, as there is no real way to compensate for that. Toss the blade and start over is the most economical way to proceed....I've been there!

    Since I have a metal pattern that I know works, I line up the point of the pattern with the point of the blade stock. If you look at the end, of the tang, the blade stock should be LONGER than the pattern as I asked you to leave a bit more on the end, right? Clamp the pattern on the blade stock and drill. I drill with a slightly under size drill than the pivot and then ream the hole to the exact diameter of the pivot...I just don't like any play when I can avoid it. If you have a 3.15mm drill, that's just about the perfect size, and you and skip reaming. For those working from the paper pattern on flat stock, you should have two nice punch holes to use to center where the holes should be. Carefully position the drill and drill away!
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    Default Shop tip for clamping...

    When you have nice, finished precision ground stock and you need to clamp it, but don't want to leave marks from the vise grip, consider this mod I did to a mini vise grip... I silver soldered some thin brass stock to the jaws. Now you don't have to worry about marking up the blade!
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    Default drilling the thumb stud hole

    Again, make sure the drill is perpendicular to the stock! Find the little punch hole, or line the drill up with the clamped pattern and blade stock and drill away...I use a # 50 drill for this, so I can then put the threads in with a 2/56" tap. I think in a previous entry we discussed different ways to handle the thumb stud, but this is how I do it.
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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    Now you should have the holes drilled to the correct size, and the correct position on your blade stock.... (notice how much extra I left on the blade stock here?)
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    Default tapping the thumb stud hole

    I used to dread this! I Broke more taps than I could afford to buy.
    I followed all the instructions, and even bought a "tapping aid" that was supposed to keep things square etc....no luck. I almost bought one of those $400 plus tapping gizmos that works on your mill or drill press. Glad I didn't !

    Now is the time to tap that hole before you forget and heat treat the steel! I occasionally forget, and fill the room with blue language....

    But not today!

    Put the blade in a mini vise (mine has plastic jaws, and if yours doesn't, take care to avoid deep marks made by the vise jaws)

    Anyway, here's a good tip for using small taps...

    find a connector that will hold the tap, and fit in a plain old electric screwdriver. Black and Decker makes a AA battery powered one for less than $10. Put a drop of cutting oil on the tap, allign the tap to a 90 degree angle with the blade and press the drive button on the screwdriver. Mine has a clutch so if it starts to bog down, the clutch will slip and you won't break the tap. It also helps to use a sharp tap, of course....

    Just make sure you have a firm hold on the screwdriver and concentrate on keeping it aligned. The tap will do all the work. Keep it running (you won't normally have to stop and reverse the tap every few threads!) and let the tap go straight through to the other side. These screwdrivers have great torque, but slow, steady speed, which is what makes this work! Be sure to take your thumb off the button after you're through! If you hit the base of the tap against the blade, it WILL break. Now, just hold it steady and hit the reverse button. Don't pull, the tap will push itself out just fine. Again, just hold it steady and aligned.

    Practice on thinner stock to get a feel for this...but it does work. I've logged hundreds of holes on just one of these tiny taps this way, with no casualties.
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    Last edited by Knipper; 08-25-2008 at 08:57 PM.
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    Default Alligning the tap to the work

    keep a firm grip, and at 90 degrees to the work...
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    Default Marking blade bevel lines

    These are just reminders when I'm grinding the bevel, so I don't grind too far back on the blade. You want to leave enough room around the thumb stud hole so the stud is all on a flat surface, not hanging over the hollow grind of the blade....
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    Default Another shop tip!

    Since I'm close to grinding the blade, I thought I'd show you what I came up with to help me hold the small folder blade while I'm grinding....

    The center disk is one of those "super" magnets, and I put it there to hold the hex wrench that fits the socket head screws, so I wouldn't lose it....
    Has anyone seen my hex wrench???!

    I just drilled a hole in each end to accommodate a 1/8" pivot on one end and a 3/16" pivot on the other. The socket head screws are in slightly over-sized slots so they can move back and forth freely, and they have a nut and lock washer on the other side.

    The blade is positioned on the pivot and screwed down there. then, I adjust the socket head screws to act as a 'stop pin' and lock them tightly when the blade is at the angle I want. Since I grind free hand, edge up into the belt grinder wheel, this provides me with a nice handle! I sometimes use a square piece of scrap stock with a step cut into it, to support the bottom of the blade. They get quite hot when grinding. I've tried gloves, but I lose too much feel for the work.
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    Last edited by Knipper; 08-25-2008 at 08:21 AM.
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    Default Grinding aid with blade

    Here's what it looks like all set up...
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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    Thanks Terry - I really appreciate the time and effort you are devoting to this thread.
    Dirk
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    Default Cut out liners

    Well, you can cut out the liners to shape now, but we won't be using them for a while...DON'T drill any holes in them yet!!!

    Since I'm all ready to grind and heat treat, I won't have any more pics until those operations are done.

    Much as I wish there was a way, trying to "teach" grinding from one-image pics on the net just isn't practical. I find it hard enough to teach in some of the seminars I've given. Its really a tactile thing, and though I can show you how, why and what to do, I can't impart the necessary sense of feel and cause and effect that one needs. That just takes lots of practice... So put on the grind you prefer in the way you were taught or know how...

    I'll share what I use for heat treating settings when the time comes, but it will be for the CPM154CM steel I'm using for Dirk's blade here.

    Future steps may seem tedious at times, but stick with it....after a certain point, it literally all comes together! That's when things get exciting and you can visualize what the knife is going to look like....

    Terry
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    Last edited by Knipper; 08-25-2008 at 02:43 PM.
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    Default tutorial...

    You're welcome, Dirk! Glad to do it....

    If someone gets even one useful tip out of all this, it will make it worthwhile..

    Terry
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    Default Ground blade

    Here's a shot of the blade after grinding but before heat treating. I started with a 50 grit belt to hog off some metal, and then finished with a 60 micron Mylar belt to remove the deep grind marks. The idea here is to grind symmetrically while maintaining a slightly thicker edge to avoid warping during heat treat.

    The blade (covered with a protective foil to avoid carbon burn off and the the resulting pitting on the blade) will be put into an electric heat treating furnace cold, then the furnace will be set to 1950 degrees F. When the blade slowly heats up and reaches that temp, it will be allowed to soak there for 30 minutes.
    Then it is quickly removed from the foil packet and quenched in heat treating oil.
    This steel can be quenched in air, but I use oil as I want to set the hardness as soon as possible. It probably works the same in air, but I'm more comfortable using oil. After it stops sizzling in the oil, I put the blade (held with tongs this whole time...) between two pieces of heavy flat granite ( broken tombstones, actually, obtained at no cost from a monument maker's mistake pile) and stand on it for 15 seconds or so. This steel is pretty amazing stuff. Right after quenching, the blade is so hard, a new file will skate right over it. But for 10 minutes or so, it retains plastic qualities and can actually be bent by hand, and it will stay bent! This is a good thing, because if the blade warped a bit during the quench or heat treating, it can be easily straightened. That's why I put it between two flat polished slabs of granite.

    After 15 seconds, the rock has dissipated enough heat so that the blade can be hand held (at least by a knifemaker with callused hands!) I sight down the edge and back of the blade, looking for any irregularities, and straighten them now before the steel 'sets up'. Usually you can do this by hand.

    After the blade reaches room temp, I put it in another oven to temper it and draw down the hardness to a more practical and useful range....RC 59-61.
    The blade is placed in another oven set to 400 degrees F, and allowed to soak there for 2 hours. Then its taken out and allowed to cool to room temperature. Then, back in the oven for another two hours.

    After the second cooling, the blade is ready to be finished and ground to the liner lock geometry I'll show you in the next series of pics.
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    Last edited by Knipper; 08-25-2008 at 09:02 PM.
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    Default Ground blade, edge view

    Here's an edge-on view of the ground blade...
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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    Hi Terry, I really appreciate your effort you are putting to this thread.

    I dunno if it is right time, but can you, please, share your experience with taping holes in titanium liners? Does it feel different from taping steel or do you use the same method with the accu hand drill?

    I think it would be handy to have some sort of stand for the drill, like pillar or something to keep things square. Am I right or wrong? Does the squareness of the hole keep the tap square by itself or is it possible to spoil work this way?
    Last edited by Karel; 08-25-2008 at 04:51 PM.
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    Default Threading the liners

    Karel,

    I'll include some shots of this when the blade is finished and I'm drilling and tapping the liners...things move a bit faster after that.

    But in answer to your question, its done the same way. I put the liner in a vise so its straight across the vise head lengthwise, and the pre-drilled holes are accessible. Then, I hand hold the driver* and sight down on the liner and just make sure it looks like I'm at right angles to the liner with the tap. Gentle pressure is all that's needed to get it started. Those drivers have good torque and once you feel the tap take hold just keep holding the driver firmly (not hard, just enough so it doesn't twist in your hand) and the tap just plows on through. I wouldn't worry about setting up a fixture to keep the set up at right angles, your eye is enough, especially when it gets started. You just want to avoid sudden left to right movements with your hand. I was concerned when I first tried this too, but it was so easy I soon approached it with confidence. Anything was better than hand tapping....can't tell you how many $8.00 taps I broke doing it that way.

    Tell you what, I'll try to take an MP3 movie of the operation with my digital camera, and post it as a link to my website. Then you'll be actually able to watch what's going on.
    Sound good?

    Terry



    *(its really not a drill...I have a friend that uses a variable speed model, but if you start too fast, it will probably bottom out and break the tap, plus it heavier and harder to hold steady...works for him, though)
    Last edited by Knipper; 08-26-2008 at 07:49 PM.
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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    Many thanks for your answer. Yes, I heard lot of horror stories about broken taps in titanium and I myself broke few tapping just steel liners.. Thats why I asked. The video sounds good.
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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    Knipper...you must remember that Karel is a compulsive perfectionist...
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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    LOL...
    That's ok Dirk...I can wander that way myself on occasion...

    Karel ( and anyone else!) Here's the link to how that driver works. The piece in the vise is 6AL4V, titanium alloy, .050 thick, and I drilled a 3/64" hole to accommodate a 0-80 tap.
    I'm using a 0-80 tap in the video that has done about 42 holes already, so its not brand new. That size is quite small, but as you will see, this method is so straightforward that I don't think you'll have any problems with it!

    When you click on the link below, it will download the video. You should have some kind of player already installed on your computer that will read this. I used low res, so as not to take up a lot of space, but you should be able to stretch the viewer somewhat to make it bigger before it starts to pixelate.

    Let me know what you think!

    Terry

    www.knipknives.com/images/tappingtheliner.MPG
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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    That is most excellent!
    Thanks.
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  45. #45
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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    I just saw it. Very impressive and ingenious. Thank you very much.
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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    Best tutorial I have read in a looooooong time. Very exciting stuff. Thank you Terry - this is really outstanding material - and so well described.

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    Default waiting for tempering to finish

    I have the blade out of the furnace and quenched. Now its going to be about a four hour wait (for tempering) before I can get to the next stage and post pics of the real meat of this whole presentation, finishing the blade and the lock set up. No matter what shape or geometry you might prefer on the locking surface of the blade tang, this method should help you attain a more positive locking action, and eliminate any 'sticking' when you push the locking tab to close the knife. It should also eliminate a lot of 'adjustments' to the lock after assembly, which, if done too aggressively, can ruin the project, or at least some crucial parts.

    Maybe now would be a good time to field some questions on what we've covered, if you have any....

    Knipper
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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    Judging by the number of times this thread has been viewed, there is a lot of interest in this project.
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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    I do have one question....do you make one knife start to finish, or do you make more than one component at one time for any given pattern?
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    Default Re: Making a liner lock folder...One way to do it...Intro and a bit o' Philosophy

    Dirk,

    I tried to do the 'assembly line' thing once, but it just wasn't as fun or satisfying as doing them one at a time, start to finish. I may cut out 3 blades for a given pattern, but I take 'em one at a time and make the whole knife before I start on the next one. I think I pay more attention to the quality of the project that way.

    Terry
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